bigdaddyhedg
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my babys - 2008/01/23 22:17
Hi Im new to the forums 
First Id like to say Hi and tell you a lil bit about my self.
I am a experienced exotic pet owner I have owned everything from chameleons to bird eating tarantulas. I have owned many others but have never tried exotic mammals.
I have a live in girl friend and she had said she would love to have hedgehogs. at that point I have heard of them before as pets but never really thought about it. I Did some research on them and found that I could probably handle them. So I began the search for them, Needless to say they don't sell them at any old pet store or even any old exotic pet store.
I posted some messages online asking about where to buy some and a few people answered. I talked to one woman who said she bought 2 at a exotic animal expo so I decided to go to the same one. I called ahead to make sure some good breeders would be there.
Well with my luck none of them showed the day of the expo  . So I talked to the same woman and it turns out one of hers is pregnant and she wants to sell both the daddy and the mommy so I jump on it. by then I had already read up and asked about what to look for in a health hedg so I wasn't to worried about getting 2 sick hedgehogs.
I brought them home my girl friend fell in love with them and I found out some cool and funny things about them I didn't find out from any breeders or online sources. Like the fact they like dust baths and how they like to play with cat balls .
well I told my girl friend that I would give her the males and allow her to rais him, as I took the female as my own project to make sure very thing went well when she gave birth. Soon she gave birth on the 8th i believe which means on the 28th they will be 3 weeks.
Since I have never had hedgehogs or baby hedges I am not sure it is safe to start handling them. I have gotten conflicting sources saying at 2 weeks I can handle them others saying 4 weeks.
Now You should keep in mined the female was very agitated most of her stay with me. and never ever uncurl in my hands no matter how much I tried.
help please
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HamorHollow
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/24 01:14
Welcome to our forum!
You want to be very cautious in dealing with your female and her babies. She doesn't know you, so she isn't going to want you poking around in her nest. I know it's hard to stay away, but my recommendation would be to wait until the babies are at least 3.5 weeks old before trying to handle them. That way, if mom freaks out and tried to hurt the babies, she can be removed and the babies will survive on their own (it's not ideal, but they would make it and be fine).
Read everything you can in our breeding and babies section.
My recommendation would be to not breed the mom again until you have established a trusting relationship with her.
-K
Kelly Sosik-Hamor
Hamor Hollow Hedgehogs - a New Hampshire breeder, serving Massachusetts, New Hampshire, Vermont, Rhode Island, Connecticut, New York, New Jersey and any where else hedgehogs are legal. |
Do you want to buy a baby Hedgehog? Please fill out out questionnaire. |
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Kelly J
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/24 06:49
Good advice, and a good way to safeguard against anything awful happeneing as a result. It's always gonna be more difficult to access the hedgies behavior if she hasn't been in your lives long, or she doesn't trust you.
Fizzgig gave birth six weeks ago and it was a whole new experience for me too. I wanted to do everything to the letter, but as I've since found out, wild animals don't seem to have read the textbook on how to be parents 
Fizzgig came to us in the first place because nobody else wanted a grump chog. Everytime I held her she'd huff and puff and make it clear she'd rather be anywhere else but with me. Over time though, it became apparent that she wasn't half as unsociable as the breeders had said. She just wasn't keen on ealing with people when she'd just woken up. Like me, she's far more friendly when she's had the hedgehog equivalent of a coffee and cookie
However, because I could almost second guess what she'd do next, I was able to tell when she was just tired (who wouldn't be after giving birth?) and when she was protecting her babies or being aggressive.
The first time that I held one of her babies was at around the three week mark, when one of them had decided to go play in the sandpit (aka the litter box) and make poo-castles. The little chog seemed at a loss once she'd had some fun and was looking a bit tired, stumbly on her feet and lost. I simply picked it up, opened the nest box and allowed Fizzy to smell the hoglet before placing it back alongside Mum. All the while explaining to her what had happened, as if she understood English
"Look at this naughty little chog Fizz, she's managed to sneak right past you in broad daylight." Yes, I am somewhat mental lol
She actually seemed pleased to have her back, and thankful that I'd brought her back. After that, once I knew Fizzy trusted me around her babies I relaxed, knowing that she wouldn't disown them, hurt them etc.
Sometimes you have to intervene and sometimes it's better to just wait until you 100% sure. A lot has to be said for gut instinct and sixth sense. In short, you'll know when the time is right.
Kx
Kelly J xxx |
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bigdaddyhedg
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/24 15:52
The male likes me allot more then the female.
Another thing is I haven't seen the hoglets since they where born. One of them wondered out the den the day after they were born since then I have not seen one out the den. She made a den using some bedding and is pretty deep.
whats the best way I could bond with the female?
Should I be worried I haven't seen them run out and play?
If they should be out playing how can I get them to play?
when I finely do handle the baby's whats the best way to bond with them?
On a different note The male wont use his den box he flips it over and doesn't use it. He used to use the same one when we had both the male and female together.
Could He be missing the females company and becoming aggravated by it?
Post edited by: bigdaddyhedg, at: 2008/01/24 16:02
Post edited by: bigdaddyhedg, at: 2008/01/24 16:03
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CThogs
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/24 17:20
If mom is doing her job, she will keep the babies in the nest for the first couple of weeks so don't worry if you do not see the babies. That's a good thing-it means she is taking care of them.
In the articles section there is a lot of information and pictures of babies
http://www.hedgehogworld.com/content/category/4/74/42/
The "watch me grow" article shows the babies at all different ages.
As far as the boy flipping his box over, he's probably just doing it because he can You may want to get him something larger or different that he can't flip.
Ann
Connecticut Hedgehogs
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HamorHollow
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/24 18:26
I'm too lazy to cut and paste, so here are your answers:
1. Wait until the babies are gone and don't try to bond while she is pregnant. Read some of the articles over in our articles section and that should help.
2. No. They are tiny and nocturnal, you may not see them for awhile and you will most likely only see them later in the evening or night.
3. They will go and play when they are ready. Eyes open at about 3 - 3.5 weeks and then they start to explore more.
4. Read the articles over in the baby section. Becca wrote them, and she knows some good stuff.
5. He probably doesn't like his box. Try something different or maybe just use a little blanket to hide under. Males are solitary, so he'll be fine.
-K
Kelly Sosik-Hamor
Hamor Hollow Hedgehogs - a New Hampshire breeder, serving Massachusetts, New Hampshire, Vermont, Rhode Island, Connecticut, New York, New Jersey and any where else hedgehogs are legal. |
Do you want to buy a baby Hedgehog? Please fill out out questionnaire. |
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bigdaddyhedg
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/26 07:39
when the baby's need to be separated by sex is it alright to put the females with the mom and males with the dad?
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CThogs
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/26 07:50
No-you cannot put the babies with Dad. Male hedgehogs can destroy the babies. You need one enclosure for all the male babies and a separate enclosure for the female babies. Some of the male babies may become mature quicker than others and want to fight and they would have to be kept separately no matter what their age. If you plan to keep them all, each male will need a separate cage eventually.
You can keep the females with mom for a few extra days but you do usually have to separate them because otherwise they will not wean themselves fully with mom there. In addition, Mom will usually want a break from taking care of babies.
Ann
Connecticut Hedgehogs
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HamorHollow
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/26 16:34
Ya, what she said! 
-K
Kelly Sosik-Hamor
Hamor Hollow Hedgehogs - a New Hampshire breeder, serving Massachusetts, New Hampshire, Vermont, Rhode Island, Connecticut, New York, New Jersey and any where else hedgehogs are legal. |
Do you want to buy a baby Hedgehog? Please fill out out questionnaire. |
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bigdaddyhedg
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/27 10:11
would it be legal for me to sell the baby's since I have no license? .
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Stasi
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/27 13:33
As long as you have less than three females of breeding age, yes, it's legal for you to sell the babies.
Stasi
Terrapin Hedgehogs
Joppa, MD
www.terrapinhedgehogs.com
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HamorHollow
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/28 01:32
*I think* you also need to be licensed if you make over $500 in one fiscal year. I thought I read that, but it may only apply to cats and dogs. Definitely check with the USDA in your state because all inspectors/ states seem to be slightly different. It's always best to cover your bases.
-K
Kelly Sosik-Hamor
Hamor Hollow Hedgehogs - a New Hampshire breeder, serving Massachusetts, New Hampshire, Vermont, Rhode Island, Connecticut, New York, New Jersey and any where else hedgehogs are legal. |
Do you want to buy a baby Hedgehog? Please fill out out questionnaire. |
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Join us for Hedgehog Fest 2008
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CThogs
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/28 07:15
Everybody's situation is different because it also depends on how many other unspayed female animals you own, not only hedgehogs. If you are in doubt, call and ask and they will tell you.
Ann
Connecticut Hedgehogs
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Stasi
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/28 17:12
HamorHollow wrote:
*I think* you also need to be licensed if you make over $500 in one fiscal year. I thought I read that, but it may only apply to cats and dogs. Definitely check with the USDA in your state because all inspectors/ states seem to be slightly different. It's always best to cover your bases.
-K
Ooh! that's right Kelly! That was mentioned to me recently by the Regional office. (dumb of me to forget, sorry about that)
Stasi
Terrapin Hedgehogs
Joppa, MD
www.terrapinhedgehogs.com
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bigdaddyhedg
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/28 17:39
well I don't own any other animals.
Its bin 3 weeks now I am still wondering.
Can I place most of the females together but separate the males?
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pricklesnquills
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/28 18:23
Stasi wrote:
HamorHollow wrote:
*I think* you also need to be licensed if you make over $500 in one fiscal year. I thought I read that, but it may only apply to cats and dogs. Definitely check with the USDA in your state because all inspectors/ states seem to be slightly different. It's always best to cover your bases.
-K
Ooh! that's right Kelly! That was mentioned to me recently by the Regional office. (dumb of me to forget, sorry about that)
I'm one of the breeders that have '3 or less breeding females'. I talked to my regional office and according to them, the is no $$ limit on profit any more. And as long as your 3 or less breeding females are kept separate from your other females you can have more than 3(as long as you're not switching them out for breeding).
Now, that is what MY regional office told me. And those are the rules I go by, but I would still suggest that you check with your regional USDA office
Emily
Prickles N' Quills Hedgehogs
Breeding for Excellent Health, Personality & Color
Charlotte, NC
www.pricklesnquills.webs.com |
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Stasi
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/29 06:19
That's interesting Emily - did you talk with the inspector in your area, or the Regional office for Eastern Division? Regional is the one who recently (within the last couple of months) told me that the $500 rule does apply to hedgehogs also.
It's always so wonderful when they're consistent, isn't it?
Stasi
Terrapin Hedgehogs
Joppa, MD
www.terrapinhedgehogs.com
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pricklesnquills
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/29 06:41
Stasi wrote:
That's interesting Emily - did you talk with the inspector in your area, or the Regional office for Eastern Division? Regional is the one who recently (within the last couple of months) told me that the $500 rule does apply to hedgehogs also.
It's always so wonderful when they're consistent, isn't it?
Hm...I'm pretty sure I talked with the regional office. Here is part of the exact email from the guy:
500 threshold rule: This applies only to the breeding and wholesaling of non-exotic small mammals (i.e. chinchillas, domestic ferrets, rabbits, hamsters, gerbils, guinea pigs) If you breed and sell any of these non wild/exotic mammals wholesale (to a pet store or dealer/distributor) in excess of $500 a year, you are required to obtain a license. Any retail sales of these type animals is exempted from licensing.
3 breeding female rule: This rule applies to the breeding and selling of small wild/exotic mammals (pocket pets, i.e. sugar gliders, hedgehogs, degus, jerboas, exotic mice/rats) Under this rule if you have more than 3 breeding females, in any combination, of these animals, you are required to obtain a license to sell the offspring. Any animals not used in the business of breeding must be kept separate from the breeding stock, and if bred and the offspring sold, MUST be included.
I won't post his name, but here is where he's from: ILA AC East
Emily
Prickles N' Quills Hedgehogs
Breeding for Excellent Health, Personality & Color
Charlotte, NC
www.pricklesnquills.webs.com |
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bigdaddyhedg
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/29 13:45
today since they will be around 3 and a half weeks. I decided to take a look at see how many where in there. To my surprise I found only 1 baby in the den. I searched for body's or any thing that could tell me if she had more but they died or she ate them I found nothing.
Its just one salt and pepper female she is a good size baby. around 2 inches long and very fat.
I have read before on these forums about how some moms give birth to just one big baby.
Is this one of those cases or did the others die and she ate them?
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R@RRRpiggy
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/29 15:46
SOMEBODY ANSWER HIM!!! lol im anxoius to know the answer as well
Proud Mother of...
Kookie the Hedgie
Kitten...the kitty
Miss Muffet the Yorky
And a bijillion meal worms
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Julie Pierce
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/29 16:38
"Usually" there is some telltale sign that there were other destroyed babies if that is the case..ie bloody shavings, piece of carcass, etc. It is very possible,especially where this is a first litter with a young female, that she only had one baby.
Julie Pierce
Pierce's Pogs
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CThogs
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/29 17:05
Hm...I'm pretty sure I talked with the regional office. Here is part of the exact email from the guy:
500 threshold rule: This applies only to the breeding and wholesaling of non-exotic small mammals (i.e. chinchillas, domestic ferrets, rabbits, hamsters, gerbils, guinea pigs) If you breed and sell any of these non wild/exotic mammals wholesale (to a pet store or dealer/distributor) in excess of $500 a year, you are required to obtain a license. Any retail sales of these type animals is exempted from licensing.
3 breeding female rule: This rule applies to the breeding and selling of small wild/exotic mammals (pocket pets, i.e. sugar gliders, hedgehogs, degus, jerboas, exotic mice/rats) Under this rule if you have more than 3 breeding females, in any combination, of these animals, you are required to obtain a license to sell the offspring. Any animals not used in the business of breeding must be kept separate from the breeding stock, and if bred and the offspring sold, MUST be included.
What this email that Emily got is pretty much how the actual law reads and it is also what I have been told verbally by the regional office.
Ann
Connecticut Hedgehogs
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CThogs
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/29 17:09
today since they will be around 3 and a half weeks. I decided to take a look at see how many where in there. To my surprise I found only 1 baby in the den. I searched for body's or any thing that could tell me if she had more but they died or she ate them I found nothing.
Its just one salt and pepper female she is a good size baby. around 2 inches long and very fat.
I have read before on these forums about how some moms give birth to just one big baby.
Is this one of those cases or did the others die and she ate them?
Like Julie said, there would probably be some evidence if there had been more than one. Sometimes one baby in the nest can be awfully noisy and sound like more.
Ann
Connecticut Hedgehogs
We had a great time at Hedgehog Fest 2008!!! |
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Stasi
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/29 17:43
CThogs wrote:
Hm...I'm pretty sure I talked with the regional office. Here is part of the exact email from the guy:
500 threshold rule: This applies only to the breeding and wholesaling of non-exotic small mammals (i.e. chinchillas, domestic ferrets, rabbits, hamsters, gerbils, guinea pigs) If you breed and sell any of these non wild/exotic mammals wholesale (to a pet store or dealer/distributor) in excess of $500 a year, you are required to obtain a license. Any retail sales of these type animals is exempted from licensing.
3 breeding female rule: This rule applies to the breeding and selling of small wild/exotic mammals (pocket pets, i.e. sugar gliders, hedgehogs, degus, jerboas, exotic mice/rats) Under this rule if you have more than 3 breeding females, in any combination, of these animals, you are required to obtain a license to sell the offspring. Any animals not used in the business of breeding must be kept separate from the breeding stock, and if bred and the offspring sold, MUST be included.
What this email that Emily got is pretty much how the actual law reads and it is also what I have been told verbally by the regional office.
Which means I was dealing with a really obnoxious dude in the regional office - or, at the very least, was having a bad day! hmph.
Thanks Emily and Ann for the clarification!!
Stasi
Terrapin Hedgehogs
Joppa, MD
www.terrapinhedgehogs.com
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bigdaddyhedg
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Re:my babys - 2008/01/29 19:36
I called the woman I bought them from and asked if she ever had a litter before. She didn't know so she made some calls and found out from the breeder she got them from that she had a litter before but she killed them.
With this new info has any thing changed on the weening date?
If this is a 1 hoglet litter will the hoglet need or can be weened early?
Post edited by: bigdaddyhedg, at: 2008/01/29 19:42
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