Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/19 23:36 Our 2 1/2 yr. old hedgie (Ms. Rinn Pinnrose Puff-n-Stuff) had surgery about 2 weeks ago. Her spleen was removed and two masses ( one in her abdomen and one her reproductive organs) also removed. After a few days in the hospital we took her home. She was recuperating slower than the vet had hoped. But once at home she began eating her insectivore diet (Mazuri) on her own. She also had more energy everyday and became quite playful. We thought everything was progressing slowly but well. About week after coming home we took her back to the vet for a post op check up. We got the bad news that she had lost a considerable amount of weight. That night everything went sour. The vet gave us some A/D diet but Ms. Rinn didn't like it and immediately threw it up. After that she wouldn't eat or drink for about 36 hours. She finally starting taking water through a syringe and the tiniest bit of her food through a syringe. However, any of the cat foods, baby foods or A/D diet she throws up. For a little one that has had so little to eat for almost a week now, she has more energy than expected. She does not appear to be in pain and we truly believe she would have left this world by now if she were uncomfortable. We are realistic that the end came come at any time, however, since she seems to keep on fighting, we want to do anything possible to help. We don't want to take her to the vet because they will just hospitalize and force A/ D on her, we don't want her to go like that. Does anyone have any advice for us, specifically any other foods or powders we can try to put weight on, we would appreciate it. Thankyou all, Beth and Rick
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CThogs
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/20 00:37You may want to try either nutrical (from the vet) or ferretvite (from the pet store). They are high calorie supplements that can help them put on weight.
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vicioushippie
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/20 07:44Ann, Thankyou for the quick reply, we will certainly look into both of those products today. Yes, we are very worried, she is our best friend! Please keep her in your thoughts and thanks again. Beth and Rick
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Andrea
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/20 10:38I am sorry to hear about your hedgie. I dont really have any practical advice since I am a newbie here but I know how hard this must be for you because I am already so attached to my hedgie. I will keep you and your hedgie in my thoughts and prayers.
Andrea
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LORI611
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/20 11:15No advice here either, sorry. I just wanted to wish Ms. Rinn well! We will definitely keep positive vibes coming your way. Good Luck!! Lori & HazelLORI, SOUTHINGTON, CT Mom of: Chloe(dog), Mr.Toad(frog) and Hazel the hedgie!!
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vicioushippie
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/20 13:01Lori and Andrea, Thank you very much! Prayers and good vibes are greatly appreciated as at this point nothing else seems to be working.Everone says how their hedgies love all kinds of foods, but Ms.Rinn has always been a very picky eater so we are having trouble finding things she will eat that will be nutritous yet acceptable to her. This afternoon we are going to try Ann's [ct.hedgehogs] suggestions and hopefully she will enjoy it. Her eyes are nice and bright and she seems happy[but so skinny]. If she could just gain some weight we think she could stay with us awhile longer.She lives under the pillows on our bed and the thought of her not being there is pretty much unbearable.Sorry to ramble on, thank you again for all prayers,good vibes, etc. Thank You All, Beth and Rick
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LORI611
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/20 13:39Don't apologize for rambling!! If it helps, ramble on!! Just a suggestion, Hazel loves honeydew melon!! And canned (not freeze dried) crickets.LORI, SOUTHINGTON, CT Mom of: Chloe(dog), Mr.Toad(frog) and Hazel the hedgie!!
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Just a suggestion though, my hedgehog enjoys cooked unseasoned chicken, a little bit of cottage cheese, apples, carrots, and that is all that I have tried giving him so far I know that your hedgie is a picky eater, but maybe if you try different things you will come upon something! Keep in mind though that these are just snacks!
Also I can't remember if you said you tried cat food or not. Most hedgehogs like it and most owners make a mix of different ones. I feed my hedgie cat food from Kelly at Hamor Hollow (on this site) because she has about 8 different kinds and she knows what she is doing. Try (if you haven't already) giving your hedgehog cat food, and if she likes it try to make a mix of a couple!
Best of luck to you and your prickly friend! I know this must be very scary, and my prayers are with you!
~Felicia
EDIT: Oops I didn't see you tried cat food, sorry! Perhaps a different kind?
Post edited by: HappyHedgie8, at: 2008/03/20 15:01**Mommy of Tweetle the hedgehog!** ~Felicia :]
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CThogs
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/20 16:54Is she keeping anything down? Make sure she gets water and offer her foods you know she likes. Don't overwhelm her with choices but make sure she gets something into her if she can keep it down.Ann Connecticut Hedgehogs
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vicioushippie
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/20 19:21Ann, Thanks for your concern. The only things that Rinn seems able to keep down are water, water with honey, and her regular food (Mazuri Insectivore Diet) moistened with water and a little bit of corn oil (we have to feed it to her by syringe). We also read about a couple that had given their sick hedgie Vanilla Boost (the vitamin drink for people). We tried that with Rinn and not only did she like it, she kept it down. The problem is she's not eating enough of her food to gain any weight. We've tried A/D diet, which she threw up immediately. She wouldn't eat chicken or turkey baby food, however, I tried mixing some chicken baby food with brown rice and she ate that. However, she only managed to keep it down for three hours and then threw up. Cat food was thrown up immediately also. We also have been very careful not to ofter too much of any of the new foods and we've only introduced one new food a day. We went and got some of the ferretvite, which I mixed with a little of her food. She seemed to like it (yeah) but threw it up a few minutes later. Tomorrow, we will try to get the other food from a vet, however, we absolutely do not want to take her to the vet, we deeply feel the stress would possible kill her or at the least send her more into a down spiral. What we need is some kind of tasteless weight gain something that can be added to her food (Suggestions from any and all greatly appreciated!) It is all so strange because she is still so bright eyed and even plays with the little energy she has. Sorry to keep going on and on but we can't imagine life without her and I don't think she's ready to leave yet either. ADVICE FROM ANYONE IS GREATLY NEEDED AND APPRECIATED! Thanks, Beth and Rick P.S. Ann- Thanks again for your help and concern!
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vicioushippie
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/20 19:40Felicia, We just wanted to thank you for your concern ,advice,and prayers. As you can see from our last post we are trying everything we can . unfortunatley our vet [who did a great job on a difficult surgery] would keep her there and force feed her which we believe would kill her[she did not like staying there] from the stress of the ordeal . if she must go we would rather it was at home with the people that love her however hard it is to accept, so we will not give up until she shows that she is ready to pass on . we would give anything ,everthing to make her alright again. thank you again for your concern.
Thank you, Rick and Beth
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Peppersmama
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/20 21:51Oh I feel so bad for you both! I don't have any suggestions but I am praying for you guys! We just lost our guy a couple of weeks ago when he stopped eatting. It's sad that you can't go to a vet, but I know where you are coming from....our guy died right after we admitted him to the animal hospital. Our vet said the stress just got the best of him and he died while she was holding him. Be prepared though... If it's his time to go, then be prepared for the sight. Watching Pepper wobbling around and falling down that last day was heartbreaking. His eyes were so shiny and sad, and he could barely stand, but I wish we wouldn't have taken him in now as we would have at least had those last few hours with him.....my heart goes out to you!
Annette
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CThogs
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/21 07:39Even if you do not want her to stay at the vet, keep in touch with your vet because they may have valuable insight into how you can help her. It can be a balancing act to give her a good quality of life. Our first hedgehog had surgery and did not want to eat afterward. She was with us for an additional 6 or 7 months with a very good quality of life thanks to extraordinary efforts by my vets and Kelly at Hamor Hollow. I drove them all nuts with questions
Is she on antibiotics? That may be upsetting her stomach too. If so, you may want to try beneficial bacteria (benebac in a tube at petstore) or yogurt.Ann Connecticut Hedgehogs
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HappyHedgie8
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/21 08:26Peppersmama wrote: Oh I feel so bad for you both! I don't have any suggestions but I am praying for you guys! We just lost our guy a couple of weeks ago when he stopped eatting. It's sad that you can't go to a vet, but I know where you are coming from....our guy died right after we admitted him to the animal hospital. Our vet said the stress just got the best of him and he died while she was holding him. Be prepared though... If it's his time to go, then be prepared for the sight. Watching Pepper wobbling around and falling down that last day was heartbreaking. His eyes were so shiny and sad, and he could barely stand, but I wish we wouldn't have taken him in now as we would have at least had those last few hours with him.....my heart goes out to you!
Annette
That made me start to cry
Oh and by the way sorry for suggesting to try a lot of new things, I have only been an owner for about a month and still have a ton of questions myself. I agree with Ann that you should keep in touch with your vet so that you can get suggestions without actually being there.
Once again I know how this must feel and your still in my prayers! I will try to maybe find something on the internet about hedgehogs that wont eat after surgery and give you the link if I do find something.
~Felicia
Post edited by: HappyHedgie8, at: 2008/03/21 08:27**Mommy of Tweetle the hedgehog!** ~Felicia :]
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vicioushippie
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/21 11:50Ann, We've been keeping in touch with our vet, however, they haven't had much more advice except to keep trying the A/D diet. I am also wondering if there is anything out there that might soothe the nausea so that she could eat the A/D diet, chicken etc. (I'll check with my vet on that one too). It is so strange, though, because she will keep down her food. Thanks, as always, for the advice and concern. We would be blessed if we could get another 6 months with Rinn. Beth and Rick
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vicioushippie
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/21 11:59Annette, Thank you for your concern. We are so sorry for your loss! It was very sweet of you to have taken the time to think of us. I am sure you gave Pepper a wonderful life and he knew you were only trying to help at the vet. I can't even imagine how to deal without Rinn so I don't know quite what to say, except that our hearts and thoughts go out to you ! Beth and Rick
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Julie Pierce
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/21 12:02So sorry to hear about Rinn. In the past we have had success with a little bit of Pepto Bismal to help soothe upset tummies. Just a little with an eye dropper and hopefully it will help a little bit.
We have also had non eating hedgies in the past and it can be very stressful. You may want to try a little bit of Puppy formula (not kitten formula) mixed with Ferretvite. They will usually always drink that right from a bowl. If that works then you mix in a little of the AD with it to a soupy consistency, if that works grind up some kibble into it, etc to you are back at a solid consistency.
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Andrea
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/21 14:29I am still praying and sending positive healing vibes your way. I was wondering about organic unsweetened apple sauce for your hedgie. I know my Spikey has eaten organic apple without any green pooping and applesauce in humans is part of the BRAT diet (bananas, rice, applesauce, tea/toast) used when somebody is having gastric upsets. Since you are using a syringe, maybe the applesauce would work. Maybe just try a really small amount.
My only other suggestion would to maybe try the chicken babyfood (are you using organic?) again and maybe just give a really small amount to prevent vomiting. I know it seems counterintuitive since he is skinny but his stomach has probably shrunk and maybe he is getting overstuffed and then throwing up.
And keep encouraging the fluids to prevent dehydration.
I realize these are probably shots in the dark, as I am totally new at this. Just know I am praying for you all.
Andrea
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vicioushippie
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/21 18:19Julie, Thanks for writing! We actually haven't tried any formulas, only the baby and cat/dog foods. We are certainly going to look into the puppy formula. We were also wondering/thinking about trying human weight gain powders, since Rinn is taking the vanilla boost (she seems to like vanilla). Have you or anyone else out there heard or know about using weight gain powders in hedgies? Thanks again for your concern, Beth and Rick
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vicioushippie
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/21 18:26Andrea, Thanks so much for continuing to think of Rinn, good vibes and prayers always appreciated. I am going to take your advice and try rice again. She ate it mixed with chicken baby food, and although she threw it up it was 3 hours later, and I think the rice was what kept it down longer. So we are going to try rice, alone or with a very small amount of something else. We are so thankful for yours and everyone's thoughts, advice, prayers and concern! Beth and Rick
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Andrea
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/21 18:54Please keep us posted on how your hedgie is doing; I am really hoping that you find something that works. And I agree with your decision to keep your hedgie with you at home instead of risking the stressful car trip. I would do the same thing.
Rice and applesauce are part of the BRAT diet in humans used for gastric upset. If your hedgie seems to be tolerating the rice then maybe I would try to re-present that at some point.
Your hedgie is lucky to have such caring parents.
Andrea
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Julie Pierce
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/23 07:38Julie, Thanks for writing! We actually haven't tried any formulas, only the baby and cat/dog foods. We are certainly going to look into the puppy formula. We were also wondering/thinking about trying human weight gain powders, since Rinn is taking the vanilla boost (she seems to like vanilla). Have you or anyone else out there heard or know about using weight gain powders in hedgies? Thanks again for your concern, Beth and Rick
Hi Beth and Rick, I have used vanilla boost also with my kids and they do seem to enjoy it. I have never tried the wt gain powders for people with my hedgies though so I can't really make a recommendation on that.
I have had some difficulty with one of my little females (she is pet only and not a breeder for this very reason) as far as eating and keeping wt on since she came to me at 4 mths. She has been so bad at times that I really thought we would lose her. She went through several sessions of sub-q fluids at the vets, and at home we were syringe feeding her (Kelly was awesome and took Lilly for me for a while and took on the syringe feedings because I work 12 hour shifts on the weekends) puppy formula and ferretvite for weeks. It was very scary and difficult time.
Now this is only "my suggestion" based on what I would do with Ms Rinn just based on my experiences with Lilly. I would give her a little pepto via a dropper (they love the taste of it) about 20 minutes before you are going to feed her so it can coat her tummy. Then syringe about 1 tablespoon of puppy formula and ferretvite into her. Take a break and see how she does keeping it down. The acid from her throwing up, just like in people can cause damage to esophagus, etc. It is better for her to hold down a little bit at a time and have to increase feedings (every 2-3 hours) than to feed her a lot at once and have it come back up.
I hope things turn around for you guys soon. Its very heartbreaking when they are ill. Good luckJulie Pierce Pierce's Pogs http://www.piercespogs.com
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CandJ327
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/23 09:03vicioushippie, We have you in our thoughts here! We are first time hedgie owners so do not have a lot of knowledge to impart. But Ann and Julie are very knowledgable so I would trust in what they have to offer. They have both suggested adding ferrettevite in various ways and I can attest that our hedgie loves it almost more than mealworms and we give it to her every once and awhile as a treat. Hopefully your little girl will like it as well. We hope everything turns out for the best. Please keep us posted.Ava's mom!
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vicioushippie
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Re:Ms. Rinns surgery, refusal to eat HELP! - 2008/03/23 14:58Julie, thank you again for taking your time to respond to all our questions [Thanks to Ann,andrea, felicia and everyone who has helped us through this difficult time. God bless you all].We are trying the pepto, puppy formula and ferritvite right now and will post again when we see what happens. The only time we gave her ferritvite[by itself] she vomited immediatley.We have picked up all the suggested supplements and will slowly introduce them until something works[hopefully] Beth will post the results of your suggestions later today along with a few questions about some of these supplements [dosage etc.] . THANK YOU ALL!!! for your time ,patience,positive thoughts Rick ,Beth and most of all Ms. Rinn Pinnrose
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Hedgehog Forums 
Our 2 1/2 yr. old hedgie (Ms. Rinn Pinnrose Puff-n-Stuff) had surgery about 2 weeks ago. Her spleen was removed and two masses ( one in her abdomen and one her reproductive organs) also removed. After a few days in the hospital we took her home. She was recuperating slower than the vet had hoped. But once at home she began eating her insectivore diet (Mazuri) on her own. She also had more energy everyday and became quite playful. We thought everything was progressing slowly but well. About week after coming home we took her back to the vet for a post op check up. We got the bad news that she had lost a considerable amount of weight. That night everything went sour. The vet gave us some A/D diet but Ms. Rinn didn't like it and immediately threw it up. After that she wouldn't eat or drink for about 36 hours. She finally starting taking water through a syringe and the tiniest bit of her food through a syringe. However, any of the cat foods, baby foods or A/D diet she throws up. For a little one that has had so little to eat for almost a week now, she has more energy than expected. She does not appear to be in pain and we truly believe she would have left this world by now if she were uncomfortable. We are realistic that the end came come at any time, however, since she seems to keep on fighting, we want to do anything possible to help. We don't want to take her to the vet because they will just hospitalize and force A/ D on her, we don't want her to go like that. Does anyone have any advice for us, specifically any other foods or powders we can try to put weight on, we would appreciate it.
I know that your hedgie is a picky eater, but maybe if you try different things you will come upon something! Keep in mind though that these are just snacks!
